A post from 2 days ago presented a graph that showed an important variation in the active userbase: https://discuss.tchncs.de/post/52565659
Using the daily rather than monthly view on https://lemmy.fediverse.observer/dailystats&days=120 shows a much stable line (especially if you take into account Piefed’s growth: https://piefed.fediverse.observer/dailystats&days=120 )
Going through the comments in the other posts, a few recommendations that can help with the overall experience
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use different feeds: either using different Lemmy/Mbin accounts (one account per type of content), or Piefed personal feeds, but being able to browse different feeds such as “Good news”, “Hobbies”, “Art”, “Life advice” help to see more content than politics and tech
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discover communities: subscribe to !communitypromo@lemmy.ca, !fedigrow@lemmy.zip and !newcommunities@lemmy.world to add active communities to your feeds
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go to general communities rather than specific ones: the current user base only allows so much specialization. Your favorite city builder community may not exist, but !citybuilders@sh.itjust.works does. !stationery@lemmy.world and !pen_and_paper@lemmy.world may be inactive, but !journaling@sh.itjust.works is not.
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use a client that allows for comments consolidation: I don’t remember which mobile apps does it (Sync, I think?), Piefed has that feature built-in too. It allows to see all comments on a cross-post in the same view: https://piefed.zip/c/privacy/p/928874/worst-in-show-ces-products-include-ai-refrigerators-ai-companions-and-ai-doorbells#post_replies
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report toxic users and avoid communities that do not handle your reports: quite a few comments mentioned that issue in the other thread. Mods can’t see everything, reporting helps to keep the atmosphere of a community enjoyable.
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use a client that implements keyword filters: quite a few mobile apps and alternative Lemmy front-ends do, Piefed has it built in. It can really help avoid the “doom and gloom” overwhelming your feed.
Finally, a few communities recommendations for lighthearted communities
Oh people making the claim that Lemmy being too political or too hard-left drives users off and is responsible for the user malaise. I’m sure that’s true, but not to an appreciable level.
Lemmy is being too political. We don’t like it.
Meanwhile Reddit:
The difference, one would assume, is that on the whole, Reddit’s political biases influence more what is not shown (much like lemmy.ml banning people for any criticism of Russia, China, or North Korea, or the echo chamber in hexbear), whereas Lemmy’s tankie issue also manifests as people actively sea-lioning (e.g. Cowbee) and (especially from hexbear) overt trolling, which shows up more in people’s faces. Both are issues, neither are good.
Always claims of sea-lioning, but never any evidence. You’ve had me blocked for over a year now, why continue this crusade?
I’ve come across some people who have no idea what “sealioning” even means. There used to be a hb user “Ulysses” or something, like three years ago, who accused me of doing it after I replied to their reply to my reply, and that’s the only conversation we’d ever had. I pulled up the definition of sealioning and the comic which the word originated from, and they just say “no that’s not true, stop sealioning”.
I feel like some people just think sealioning means “this person keeps replying to my posts”, as if conversations on a public forum are somehow uncalled for, or unusual.
It’s a real thing, for sure, but more often than not is used as a conversation terminator.
The sealion in the original comic is completely correct, which makes me very suspicious of anyone who dismisses someone for “sealioning” and as you say, it usually is just used as an excuse not to engage with what someone is saying.
The sealion in the comic overheard someone being racist against them, and stepped in to say, “Hey, why are you being racist?” And for some reason is wrong because… they’re persistent? Or because they’re annoying? How is that not literally just every “anti-woke” argument?
Agreed! They take issue more with the argument style to dismiss the substance.
I think the point is that the sea lion is feigning civility while harassing someone over a casual opinion.
My response would be that if we extend the metaphor, like you did, and substitute the absurd ‘sea lions’ for a race, then harassing the racist doesn’t bother me. Bigots don’t deserve peace. It’s absolutely harassment to stalk and interrogate someone who doesn’t want to talk, I just wouldn’t care that they’re being harassed for airing such bigotry.
(On the other hand, if we assume the original opinion is not a metaphor and replace it with a similarly absurd statement, like enjoying pineapple on pizza, then the sea lion would be acting unreasonably. If someone followed you around online and kept bringing up how you prefer pizza to be prepared, demanding a calm discussion and insisting on peer-reviewed proof that pizza tastes better a certain way, while you ask them to stop, that harassment would obviously be uncalled for. For what it’s worth, the author made a comment that it wasn’t meant to be “analogous to a prejudice based on race, species, or other immutable characteristics.” - but I say it’s a though-provoking interpretation to explore regardless)
If it wasn’t meant to be analogous to prejudice based on immutable characteristics why did they make it prejudice based on immutable characteristics? Sea lions in the universe the comic takes place in are clearly sapient people, capable of complex thought, communication in English, and the ability to navigate human society. The person in the comic isn’t being “metaphorically racist” or expressing something “analogous” to racism; they’re simply being racist.
As you say, what the sea lion is doing is harassment, it is hostile, it is aggressive, and the racist depicted in the comic deserves it. It is model behavior, we should make people dread the idea of expressing racist views in public.
If you substitute the racist opinion for a mundane one, of course the comic changes and the sea lion becomes unreasonable. You’ve completely changed what the sea lion was responding to. If you swap all the Nazis in Wolfenstein with peaceful dogs who aren’t doing anything, now it’s a game about being a cop. Now you’re being completely unreasonable by shooting them. But that doesn’t tell us anything about the validity of shooting the original Nazis. When we look at the original context of Wolfenstein, shooting the Nazis is completely reasonable because they’re Nazis and not dogs.
Furthermore, even if we do substitute the racism expressed in the comic for a more mundane opinion, like enjoying pineapple on pizza, it still seems inapplicable to internet arguments. A significant part of the reason the sea lion is unreasonable is its persistence. At no point do the other people in the comic engage with the sea lion but it won’t stop harassing them. But on Lemmy, this behavior is so universally punished that it almost never happens because it would obviously get you permabanned from your home instance no matter what it is. Most people I’ve seen accused of “sealioning” are simply replying, one comment at a time, to people who are actively engaging with them. You can’t be “sealioning” unless you are following someone who isn’t engaging with you somewhere else, meaning in this context a different thread, to demand further engagement in the conversation. Which, again, would get you banned so fast that I don’t think I’ve ever actually seen it happen on Lemmy.
On no level do most accusations of “sealioning” seem to hold up to scrutiny, in my opinion.
Here is one such very relevant post: https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/comments/16hkxua/why_im_giving_up_on_lemmyfediverse/
A really interesting discussion in particular is below the reply saying:
Other replies included “I did end up shutting down my instance.”, which continued on with “But, for me, seeing people blindly bash the USA every chance they get, It’s a turn off.” - like, I get that the USA is unpopular (especially now), and also I am okay with the Threadiverse remaining small, but I did want to push back against this magical type of thinking that we can both have our cake and eat it to, in the form of both bashing people from it and also reaching out to invite people on Reddit (who are primarily from the USA) to join us here. Maybe Lemmy will have more success by marketing itself as more “European” (or at least “non-USA”, so maybe European + Global South)? Whatever goal we want to aim for, we should keep our eyes open as we aim directly at it, imho.
I do not think that all or even most Threadiverse instances should defederate from lemmy.ml, but on the other hand it would be extremely nice if just ONE instance would do so, which we could then share to people on Reddit as a nicer entry point for those more centrist-leaning users who are primarily people from the USA. Or else decide that that goal is (collectively) not what we all want. The latter being what ended up happening, whether intentionally or no.
Fwiw, Lemmy has gotten much better over the years in this respect, imho, with many more instances having banned lemmygrad.ml and hexbear.net specifically.
Like, look at those contortionist comment replies trying to state that, e.g.:
This topic is a MAJOR, oft-repeated reason why people on Reddit refuse to come here and check us out.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/comments/1jjl8g5/i_tried_lemmy_again_after_a_year_long_hiatus_and/ (the title there gets cut off but continues with “it’s still beyond terrible”), and here is that post’s concluding paragraph:
Note that I do not agree, just stating how these people said that they felt, if that is helpful for a diagnosis of the state of affairs and what we could potentially do to help mitigate those concerns. e.g. I successfully petitioned for discuss.online to defederate from hexbear.net, thinking that could help make Redditors feel more welcomed here. Although now I am placing my hope more in PieFed (which e.g. allows users to perform their own personalized defederations without needing admin approval to block all users from any specific instance), while giving up much hope for Lemmy to keep up with its wondrous pace of adding new features.
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